Ep5: Early-Commercial Investing and Revolutionizing Wound Care, with TVM Capital and Kent Imaging

[00:00:00] Henry Peck: Hey everyone, it's Henry. Welcome to Emerging Medtech Today by LSI. Today, I'm joined by Luc and Sascha from TVM Capital, and Pierre from Kent Imaging. Together, we discuss the evolution of TVM Capital, their unique investment focus on early commercial medtech companies, and how they've partnered with Kent Imaging to pioneer devices for diagnostic and help clinicians positively impact patient outcomes. Enjoy.

[00:00:26] Henry Peck: Luc, Sascha, Pierre, thank you so much for joining me this morning. Would love to have you start with an introduction on yourselves, Luc and Sascha. Talk us through the history of TVM Capital, your investment strategy, and provide some examples of portfolio companies that reflect that strategy, particularly in Medtech.

[00:00:42] Sascha Berger: Thank you, Henry. Thanks for having us. We're really pleased to be part of this podcast series, and we're looking very much forward also to to meeting people at those various LSI conferences. My name is Sascha Berger. I'm a general partner at TVM based in Munich, Germany. [00:01:00] My, my colleague and partner, Luke will introduce himself in a second.

[00:01:04] Sascha Berger: And we're, we're a very active investor in the medtech space as a venture fund that's been around for a while, but we're reinventing and refocusing our strategy as we go. Because markets are changing, companies are changing, of course. So the last 10 years, we've been very active on the medtech side with a refined and refocused strategy on companies, which are particularly in their are later stages of development and that in particular entails companies, which have products on the market and do have a commercial proof of concept or principle and are raising capital for scaling those companies going broader on the commercialization in the US or internationally, given that we as TVM and have a [00:02:00] transatlantic presence and focus, we're very keen on helping those companies grow and scale on those markets, which are most important to Western companies.

[00:02:16] Sascha Berger: And the strategy is really to position the company for a potential exit with our round of financing. And we're helping companies to achieve key value inflection points along the way besides commercialization success, and , and, broader, coverage in the respective markets.

[00:02:42] Sascha Berger: This is also the the discussion with strategics who might be interested in acquiring those companies with proof of commercialization and without going deeper into the strategy now that's for later, but the reason why we indeed [00:03:00] focus on this specific aspect and why we consider ourselves a great partner for this, maybe last part of the journey together with the entrepreneurs who have done a lot before to scale companies to that stage is that, in medtech, even though entrepreneurs are hopeful to get to an exit with a proven technology, more often we all know in particular, strategics are looking for a commercial validation on top of approved technology. And that requires additional capital, which we're happy to provide.

[00:03:35] Henry Peck: Thank you so much. Luc, would love to hear from you.

[00:03:38] Luc Marengere: Thank you again, Henry, for that opportunity. I would certainly echo Sascha's comments as well. So I'm Luc Marengere. I'm a managing partner at TVM and co-owner as well.

[00:03:50] Luc Marengere: Maybe before I get into a few examples of what we've invested in, I would highlight a couple of points as well that, that are at the heart of our investment strategy. [00:04:00] As Sasha very correctly defined that we're looking for companies that have a commercial proof of principle, we're also looking for companies that have quite a bit, in fact, of clinical data with their product, because that clinical data is absolutely key to start to understand what the value proposition will be for the patients for the health care providers.

[00:04:26] Luc Marengere: If it's a capex equipment, for example, how are you going to sell this to hospitals, right? And and ultimately what's the economic value proposition to for reimbursement. Okay. And Pierre later on will touch on that as well, but those elements are key. Also as we get into these companies, and we'll talk about that later on when we focus a little bit more about our exit strategy, is that we get into these companies with the goal to really build these companies towards profitability.

[00:04:59] Luc Marengere: The old [00:05:00] saying it's it's been used a lot, but it remains quite true, companies are not sold, they're bought. And we have to build these companies to be self sustainable at some point. And that's really how we approach this.

[00:05:12] Luc Marengere: Three examples that I'd like to highlight. One is a, is an investment that Sascha and I, in fact, made together. We're both on the board based in Minneapolis. In fact, it's called Egg Medical. As the name would entail, egg has conceived of a cocoon like carbon fiber device that goes on the the table used in cath labs.

[00:05:36] Luc Marengere: So when a cardiologist does a procedure requiring a C arm and the C arm is required, of course, to generate the image but in doing so radiates the room, right? That particular cocoon goes right around the table, right around the patient and protects not just the doctor doing the procedure, but also protects [00:06:00] everyone in the room, which is absolutely key.

[00:06:02] Luc Marengere: And I can't go into the details on this podcast per se, but one of the absolutely amazing things is that the most recent clinical data that we've generated with the most advanced Egg medical product, which is Called Egg Nest Complete, appropriately name, shows that you basically reduce the exposure to x ray radiation to scatter radiation by 99%.

[00:06:29] Luc Marengere: That means that these people in the room can now remove their lead aprons. Okay, so this is transformative. Okay. And this is also a common denominator to the investments that we make, we don't make investments in devices that provide an incremental advancement or a bit of a me too kind of thing.

[00:06:49] Luc Marengere: They have to be transformative. They have to be able to be positioned to become the new standard of care. Okay, so Egg Medical, when we first invested [00:07:00] in them, they had approximately 2 million dollars in sales in top line revenues, and we invested to support the broader commercialization in the U. S. as well as in Europe. They just received their CE mark. Okay, so that's 1 example. So that's CapEx. Okay.

[00:07:18] Luc Marengere: Then we made an investment in a Boston based company called Access Vascular. So AVI, they have a new biomaterial that allows them to manufacture catheters, PICC lines, midlines, okay. With the great benefit that have that, of having these catheters, these lines going in that do not occlude.

[00:07:44] Luc Marengere: So this is a key aspect of our due diligence, this key aspect of our investment thesis. So these new lines, do not occlude. They don't form a thrombus. Okay. And then therefore there's little to no risk of [00:08:00] complications. Which can be severe of having a clog, right?

[00:08:04] Luc Marengere: More recently as well, we've shown that this biomaterial which is very slippery to bring it down a little bit to a simple technical term, but is very slippery. So cells do not adhere, neither do bacteria. So you cannot, you do not see the presence of a microfilm. You do not see, therefore, the presence of bacterial attachment, and it dramatically reduces the infection rates. And so you can imagine that the in this sort of post covid where there's an issue with resources. There is an issue with trying to bring down costs that now you can put a catheter in, you can put a midline or a PICC line in, that does not require to be replaced within hours or within 24 hours.

[00:08:50] Luc Marengere: Okay, so great saving on time, great saving on resources, great saving on costs. And again, AVI had started commercialization [00:09:00] when we got in and now of course they're expanding broadly in the United States. The key thing with AVI is they started out with mobile care and now they're all over acute care and they are demoing and selling to very large acute care institutions.

[00:09:17] Luc Marengere: I'm not in the liberty of broadcasting their names because they would not appreciate that. But people who will listen to this podcast will know who these large conglomerate acute care facilities are. They're the brand names. Okay. And then maybe I'll finish with with Kent, of course, and that will be the segue to Pierre.

[00:09:36] Luc Marengere: When we first looked at Kent Imaging out of Calgary, Canada, they had a device that we felt again was transformational for wound care. So the ability to use near infrared technology to image the saturated oxygenation levels in limbs or [00:10:00] extremities. Okay. As it turns out the wound care application, I won't steal Pierre's thunder, but the wound care applications is only one of many applications and it's transformative.

[00:10:12] Luc Marengere: It makes a big difference, right? And again, Pierre will share with you the clinical data whereby using this device makes a massive difference for wound healing, right? There's a reason why they're called chronic wounds. So these chronic wounds actually heal. They educate the healing process. They educate the health care providers. So we're very happy with with the performance of the device. We're very happy with where we can aim that device. In fact, in other market silos, where it also has a dramatic impact on health care and and again, Pierre will touch on that a little bit more.

[00:10:55] Luc Marengere: But when we started out with Kent it had a few [00:11:00] 100, 000 dollars worth of sales, roughly. Okay and now it's growing into the millions a year. Commercial across North America. We hope to get our CE mark soon, so we'll be commercial outside of the U. S. as well. And so these are our three examples in the portfolio of companies with transformative products.

[00:11:24] Luc Marengere: We got in when they were relatively early in their commercial status. Okay, but all the clinical data, at the very heart of the investment was already in place. All of them have added clinical data, but either it confirms or it continues to show the same thing, but with newer generation products. Okay. And all 3 of these companies are being built to get to profitability and have that independence. Should an exit opportunity arise, we're all ears. But we're not necessarily running [00:12:00] for one. We're growing companies and building companies.

[00:12:04] Henry Peck: Thank you, Luc. It's great to hear about that evolution of TVM Capital and your focus today on the early commercial stage in medtech. We'll talk a little bit more about that, but first, Pierre would love you to introduce yourself and tell us about Kent Imaging.

[00:12:16] Pierre Lemire: Thanks, Henry. It's a pleasure to be here today. I've been building commercial products for over 35 years, always focused on imaging. My first 15 years was focused on building GIS and mapping solutions where I was a CTO at Autodesk and I've been building medical devices and doing medical imaging now for the last 20 years.

[00:12:38] Pierre Lemire: So I'm really excited to tell you about Kent Imaging. It's a great story and a great technology that we're commercializing. The company first started when we licensed technology from the National Research Council of Canada. Canada had invest significantly in near infrared technology, and when it had matured enough that it was ready for commercialization, we grabbed the rights to it.[00:13:00]

[00:13:00] Pierre Lemire: And so we've been focusing on commercializing the technology in Canada and the U. S. We have our FDA clearance, we have Health Canada clearance, and as Luc mentioned, we have significant clinical data to support the value of the technology.

[00:13:15] Pierre Lemire: So let me tell you a little bit about how the technology works. It uses near infrared light. And so the camera, within a fraction of a second sends multiple different images of light, sends multiple different wavelengths of light, and we measure the reflection of each of those wavelengths. And by deconvoluting the signals, we can get a color image that represents areas of the tissue that are highly saturated with oxygen, and just as importantly, areas that have very poor oxygen.

[00:13:43] Pierre Lemire: And not only do we look at the saturation, but we also can break it down into the amount of hemoglobin versus, a hemoglobin that's carrying oxygen versus hemoglobin that's not carrying oxygen. And that's very important for being able to assess, what's the volume of blood that we're seeing, as well [00:14:00] as, is there an ischemic problem?

[00:14:02] Pierre Lemire: Because even if there's hemoglobin, but it's not carrying as much oxygen as you would expect for a tissue to be healthy, then that's a very important piece of information for the clinician to know. And so it's this new information, this new imaging that we're bringing to the clinicians, that's really having the impact in changing outcomes.

[00:14:21] Pierre Lemire: Because I can't worry about providing clinicians with the tools so they can improve outcomes for patients and reduce the number of complications. This is a big problem. So in the U. S. alone, we have 12 million patients who have peripheral arterial disease. So that's the narrowing of the arteries.

[00:14:40] Pierre Lemire: And a lot of the times that scenario, that situation is not, there's no signs that indicate that the patient actually has a problem. And by the time it's diagnosed, it's too late. They've developed an ulcer, they've developed a wound. And it's very hard to now claw that back and bring it back to healing.

[00:14:57] Pierre Lemire: And so one of the big [00:15:00] focuses that we have is to apply the technology for being able to early detect peripheral arterial disease. And that has the potential to save billions of dollars to the healthcare system. So we've developed a provocative maneuver that you can image a patient with their foot just in a flat position, supine, and then we elevate that and when we elevate, we actually see a significant decrease in oxygenation in those patients who have P. A. D.

[00:15:27] Pierre Lemire: And so at rest, it looks like they have adequate oxygenation and our tool actually report that there might be actually be adequate oxygenation. But with this provocative maneuver, it takes the guessing out. And it clearly shows that the patient has a problem and they need to send them to vascular.

[00:15:45] Henry Peck: Interesting. You mentioned a lot of those applications in the treatment decision and the almost kind of that diagnosis phase. Are there applications in tracking long term monitoring for things like this? Does this go beyond the diagnosis and kind of [00:16:00] for that full spectrum?

[00:16:02] Pierre Lemire: Yeah, definitely. Especially when you're tracking a patient who has diabetes and you want to ensure that they're not developing some kind of vascular disease. And so every time they come in for their monthly visit, you can image them and see right away if there's a change in their oxygenation and pick it up a lot earlier than you might otherwise. Right now, the way to pick it up is if a wound develops or they start complaining about pain. We can pick it up sooner as a result of having access to the imaging.

[00:16:33] Pierre Lemire: And let me give you a, an example. One of the clinician, one of the sites that we're working with has been using our technology for over a year now. Prior to using our device, their healing rates were about 52% for healing wounds, and their amputation rate was 12%. So 12% of the patients they were treating ended up with an amputation. After a year of using our device, that healing rate went from 52%, up to 72% and more importantly, the [00:17:00] amputation rate went from 12% down to 7.6%.

[00:17:04] Pierre Lemire: And so that's just look at the impact to a patient, to know that they didn't have an amputation and the lifestyle change and all the implications to the family from being able to prevent that amputation. That's very big. And to the healthcare system, of course, there are significant costs in having to, one, do that amputation and then, and the lifelong treatment of that patient who's now has an amputation and the mortality rate for patient who has an amputation is extremely high, less than five years typically. So it's a big problem that we're addressing.

[00:17:37] Henry Peck: That's really interesting data. And you know, as Luc and Sascha mentioned, they're focused on investing in transformational technologies rather than incremental improvements. And it sounds like your solution can be as fundamental and impactful to measurement in this space as the blood pressure cuff was. So as you talk about patient impact, I'm left wondering what tools do clinicians currently have at their disposal in this space? Does anything like this [00:18:00] exist?

[00:18:01] Pierre Lemire: Yeah. So the wound care market has been significantly underserved when it comes to imaging. There have been rudimentary tools, I would call them rudimentary tools, that have been used, little probes that you put on the tissue to try to get some kind of measurement of pulse or something, some kind of oxygen loss from the tissue. Different things have been tried, but the repeatability is very low and the clinicians, they take time to take up to an hour sometimes, to make an assessment and they're just not very effective. And so the, this wound care market has been waiting for a technology like this for a long time.

[00:18:35] Henry Peck: Fantastic. Well, Pierre, for what it's worth, I'm convinced there's a transformational solution here. And more importantly, TVM Capital agrees, seeing as you've partnered with their team to continue building and growing this venture. Luc, back to you. Talk to me about your process at TVM Capital. How do you evaluate companies to reach an investment decision? And how do you partner with portfolio companies like Kent Imaging to help them scale and realize their vision?[00:19:00]

[00:19:00] Luc Marengere: Yeah, thank you, Henry. And you could, you can see from Pierre's description of of the science, what's behind it, how it's being applied, et cetera, how this product and others that we've invested in, can really make a big difference. You're talking about, you're talking about life saving technologies and products. Not just savings in dollars and cents, although that, of course, is also very important.

[00:19:24] Luc Marengere: So when we do the due diligence, there are certain factors that we focus in right away. And that is the mode of action. What's the credibility behind the device, right? Who's developing this, right? The integrity of people behind the device as well. And when we enter into a due diligence process, it is a demanding period for not just for the company, but also for us at TVM. We invest a lot of time and a lot of effort into that due diligence process because it does 3 things.

[00:19:59] Luc Marengere: One, [00:20:00] from a governance perspective we owe to our investors like, like all fund managers do that we do all of this work with a certain rigor. And so the due diligence must be broad. It must be deep. And it takes the time that it takes, frankly. Okay.

[00:20:18] Luc Marengere: There are two other major reasons why we do this due diligence as well. One is that we need to figure out where the risks really lie with a company and a specific product or suite of products. Okay. Once we understand the risk, we also understand how to de risk it. So what if we were to make the investment, what is the plan to now de risk these identified challenges with the company? And if you de risk, you are by definition, adding value. Okay, so that's very important because the due diligence again, highlights how we're going to build a winner here.

[00:20:59] Luc Marengere: [00:21:00] Okay. Not just the risk to decide whether to invest or not, but also how do we build a winner? How do we go from where we are today to where we need to be in 2, 3, 4, 5 years from now, and we have a company that is highly coveted by hopefully multiple industry partners.

[00:21:21] Luc Marengere: Okay, the third element, and I like your approach of of talking about, partnership. So when we do the due diligence for these companies, we're also testing out whether, how, can we work with the management team, right? Can we work with the board members as well? So that sense of partnership basically starts, right, the clock starts on, can these people be partners with us from the very first presentation?

[00:21:52] Luc Marengere: And we're looking for things that are very specific, does the management team realize [00:22:00] some of the limitations of where they are today. Are they on the same page as we are? Do they realize that they need some bolstering, some help, some guidance in certain areas because they know certain things extremely well, better than we do.

[00:22:15] Luc Marengere: But there are certain things where we can help them, right? Are they defensive or do they accept that we are going to build a partnership here, right? Usually with these companies that have an approved product, so there's no regulatory risk, they already have extensive clinical data. There's no or dramatically reduced validation of the technology related risk, right? So where does the risk lie at the end of the day? It lies in commercialization, which for most of these medical devices also include reimbursement.

[00:22:50] Luc Marengere: Okay, and of course, on the manufacturing side, right? Can we scale up the manufacturing? Do we need automation? If so, can the automation [00:23:00] even be put in place? Is it going to cost an arm and a leg to automate yes or no kind of thing, right? How do we do this? And then what we've always put that emphasis before COVID, you talk about supply chain and people would just take it for granted. What do you mean supply chain? There's not going to be an issue. Of course, we'll have access to things, right? Post COVID supply chain has become a must of musts. In terms of understanding.

[00:23:27] Luc Marengere: So again, we spend a lot of time with the companies and they're quality people within the team to really understand the supply chain and put in place a supply chain, almost philosophy now, right, culture philosophy approach, which all builds into this sort of partnership concept, right? Of making sure that at the very least where you have pinch points on the supply chain, you're going to have at least two suppliers pre [00:24:00] validated, pre qualified. So if one trips up for whatever reasons, we can very quickly go to the other one, right?

[00:24:07] Luc Marengere: We put that emphasis on that and companies that recognize that approach, that value process. These are companies and management teams with whom we can build partnerships. And of course, that, those are companies in which we invest.

[00:24:25] Henry Peck: Thank you, Luc, for those insights. Reflecting on that investment process for a moment from the other side of the table, Pierre, I want to double click on how you demonstrated the economic value proposition here in addition to the patient and clinical benefits we spoke about. I'm sure there's more than one way to skin that cat, so to speak, but can you talk me through your theory and your calculus on quantifying and articulating the economic benefits of what you're building with Ken Imaging?

[00:24:49] Pierre Lemire: Yeah, there's a lot of aspects to assessing and determining the economic value of the technology. And obviously you're weighing the cost and the changes to [00:25:00] workflow that need to happen in order for the technologies to be incorporated into an institution or a facility. And the great news is because it's imaging and it's so quick, there are not a lot of impacts to the workflow. In fact we integrate right into the existing workflow.

[00:25:16] Pierre Lemire: And so we measure the economic value by, what are the clinicians doing different to change the treatment outcomes and to change the treatment protocol to save costs to the system and to improve the outcomes for the patient and removes reduce the amount of time that they actually spent healing the wounds?

[00:25:34] Pierre Lemire: If you can reduce the time of healing a wound from 30 weeks to 15 weeks, that's big. And we already mentioned just the reduction in amputation rate, a 1% reduction amputation rate results in significant cost savings to the health system. And so in the U. S. we're leading the charge to getting reimbursement codes that are effectively paid by the insurance companies because we're seeing the [00:26:00] economic impact, we're seeing the patient impact and it's a it's a long road to convince the reimbursement, I may want to say that differently, it's an educational process to get the insurance companies to also recognize the value and seeing the change, how the change is actually being incorporated by clinicians and how we're changing how clinicians work. It's not just one more thing insurance companies paying for, it's actually something they're paying for, because it is reducing costs.

[00:26:26] Pierre Lemire: I have another great example, and this one really focuses on the wellness for a patient. So we're working with a mobile wound care company where they've, using our technology, have identified patients who they've deemed to just be in palliative care. In other words, they don't believe there's anything more they can do to the wound and they just do dressing changes and that's it.

[00:26:49] Pierre Lemire: But using our technology, they've obviously discovered that there's, is enough oxygen to actually affect the healing trajectory. And they've been able to move these patients from palliative care [00:27:00] to a course of treatment and getting wounds to heal. So that's to me, how do you put a value on that?

[00:27:05] Henry Peck: Yeah, really interesting to try and back out all of these pieces into one larger equation, but no doubt the value is there as you've quantified it. So Sascha, we've heard about TVM's investment approach and focus on the early commercial phase. And I want to dive into that because when I think about the medtech investing landscape, I feel like we paint this hard dichotomy between early stage investors and growth stage investors.

[00:27:28] Henry Peck: And it sounds like your approach in the area that you invest in almost bridges the gap between those two sides, where the angel capital and early stage VC stop, but before the larger growth equity mega rounds kick in, mega being relative to medtech, of course. Explain to me why you focus on these early commercial companies specifically. Why is this stage and mold of company a place where you see unique opportunity to generate significant financial returns?

[00:27:55] Sascha Berger: Thanks, Henry. Actually, that was a great outside analysis. We did ask [00:28:00] ourselves, where can we add most value? And we talked a lot about partnership before. We clearly identified that gap, right, from our many years of investing in the space in general, reviewing the space, that here particular expertise is needed, which we think we can add and bring to the table.

[00:28:21] Sascha Berger: Besides, and let's not forget about forget about financial resources. So with our 10 to 20 million typical investment check sizes this is potentially too much for early stage investors, early stage product development, but if you want to go into a really big indications and you want to do crossover financing for IPOs, right, then it's even more financing required.

[00:28:50] Sascha Berger: So we find there's a sweet spot from a from a financial perspective and also the value add perspective, which is strategic guidance, [00:29:00] which many companies share similar challenges and that in that early stage of commercialization. And we can also add with our networks and connections. So that means we can help on the customer side, making connections between our investment companies, open basically valuable doors to financing opportunities, besides equity financing, also potential known financing or specific support on getting equipment finance or leasing support and that's also operational expertise we can add as you highlighted that, that goes from from support on quality assessment, on getting additional validation from customer perspective is what exactly they are looking, what are they looking for to be able to make a buy decision as a [00:30:00] hospital or a large network?

[00:30:02] Sascha Berger: So these are all unique features of companies in that early commercial stage. And ultimately, of course, as a venture capitalist, we see here a sweet spot for generating outstanding returns. Because there's still some risk involved in these operations as Pierre can highlight.

[00:30:21] Sascha Berger: It's not a walk in the park. It's going out speaking with customers a lot, refining the product portfolio, making strategic decisions on how to make potentially a second generation product or a second a suite of product to add to the complete portfolio and be more attractive.

[00:30:41] Sascha Berger: And ultimately already attracting exit partners strategic who would want to acquire those companies on the product portfolio. So we're very keen on bridging here the not just the expectations, but in fact allowing our CEOs to focus [00:31:00] on building a company and a product portfolio which is attractive to larger strategics and facilitate those discussions so that the the finance thing we do could ultimately be the last financing to lead to a very valuable exit transaction. And maybe that's also something where Luc wants to add additional color to that process.

[00:31:25] Luc Marengere: I think you've teed that up very nicely, Sascha, and thank you for that. As mentioned before, we touched a little bit on this and you correctly highlight that, Henry, that we are right in between, where usually angel investors stop writing checks and just before the growth funds will endorse. Okay. And we find that's a real sweet spot for us. Some of our companies, in fact, with the, we still support these companies with sizable checks, so we'll invest 15 to 20M [00:32:00] dollars into these companies to, to grow these companies from early sales to some of them, in fact, to be able to reach profitability on their own without necessarily requiring a growth capital round.

[00:32:16] Luc Marengere: So we're trying to do this as often as we can, but we do have good relationship with a number of growth funds. In fact, sometimes in fact, they feed us deal flow and that they'll say, look, we really like this company, it's just a little too early for us. This may fall into your sweet spot, right? So everything's an ecosystem, of course, right?

[00:32:38] Luc Marengere: With regards to building companies towards an exit, our exit of choice, and this is by a country mile is a strategic M& A. Okay we're not big fans of doing an IPO with the medical device company, maybe on the diagnostic side. And I say this, I couched that comment with a big maybe, but that would be [00:33:00] a company with advanced revenues at that point, but by and large we build these companies to reach profitability to grow commercially, internationally. In fact, we've done it quite, quite a number of times. And then at that point in time, they become independent entities.

[00:33:18] Luc Marengere: And then, of course, it's optionality at that point, right? They want to raise debt to grow. They want to raise debt to finance an acquisition, add a modality, add another device. They want to get growth capital at that point in time to really expand somewhere else. And that project justifies that kind of around.

[00:33:42] Luc Marengere: We have optionality. All right, and that's the key thing. Once you once these companies get to a certain level of commercialization, they reach profitability, I can't underline the value of optionality enough for these companies, and that's usually what leads [00:34:00] to more premium acquisitions. When strategics come calling.

[00:34:05] Henry Peck: Makes sense. Thank you for that overview.

[00:34:07] Henry Peck: So as you all know, LSI Europe 23 is coming up this September in Barcelona, and all of you will be joining us there. Pierre, you'll be presenting Kent Imaging at this event. Another TVM capital portfolio company access vascular will be there and the TVM capital team will be in full force. Sascha speaking on a panel juxtaposing European and U. S. dynamics and transatlantic investing. And Luc speaking on a panel about growth and late stage investment. I want to ask all of you, what are you looking forward to discussing, sharing, learning, and doing at this event?

[00:34:37] Sascha Berger: Maybe I can start here. And the, it's excited to to be invited to the conference. It's the first time that, that this will be hosted in Barcelona. We're all, Luc and I, we've been a few times to the North American major event in Dana Point and now having a chance to meet some of those investors, [00:35:00] companies and strategic, again in Barcelona was maybe an even stronger focus on the European landscape.

[00:35:08] Sascha Berger: Also adding local investors from Europe. And also companies for representing the European ecosystem is a great prospect. And what I enjoy in past editions, and I'm looking very much forward to this event again, that's the great open minded, boundary free discussions, the possibility to exchange views informally, and meet with peers and people is a great opportunity. And in fact, we had a number of very good introductions and past additions. And I expect it will not be less this year in Barcelona.

[00:35:47] Luc Marengere: And maybe just to pick up on, on Sasha's comment. We've been to a number of these LSI conferences, frankly, congratulations guys 'cause they're always well run. So hats off to you, Henry and Scott and others [00:36:00] at LSI, you guys know how to structure a conference.

[00:36:03] Luc Marengere: I'll look forward to meeting my co-panelists as well. And, of course, we're looking for broadening the network some additional deal flow and, of course meeting with the strategics who, at the end of the day, we hope to feed some very transformative products.

[00:36:21] Pierre Lemire: And Henry, from my perspective, I'm looking forward to continuing to share the vision of Kent Imaging and what our snapshot and our technology is can do and how it's changing outcomes for patients. We have huge growth plans in addition to expanding our geographical footprint. We have very aggressive product plans, including how we're leveraging machine learning to help improve outcomes for patients. So I'm very excited to tell the story and to find a few more partners to help us continue this growth story.

[00:36:52] Henry Peck: Absolutely. Well, Pierre, we're very excited to hear your updates in just a few weeks and Sascha and Luc, looking forward to your panels and to reconnecting with you [00:37:00] both. Thank you all. And thank you to TVM capital for your support and partnership. I appreciate your time and am very much looking forward to seeing you all in Spain.

[00:37:08] Luc Marengere: Likewise, Henry. Thanks again.

[00:37:10] Pierre Lemire: Thank you very much.